Lived Experience Forum

[PeppiPatty]

Hi All, 

My friends new and old......

I was reading something and came accross this quote by Alice Miller who is a writer and Psychotherapist. She writes;

"Depression is the inability to grieve." 

Can anyone comment on this ? 

For me: it feels like I am Always going to grieve that my Mum does'nt love or listen to me. She will never take the time to be sensetive to my fragile self. Even though I've cut her off..... I still think about her. Because our meetings with his Mum are very successful,  my husband wants to see her and talks about her which is both making me feel firm in not wanting to see her but also: depressed  

[pip]

PeppiPatty. If you can imagine a huge blanket smothering you, or a black cloud hovering, that you can't move or see through, that's depression. It's extremely possible your mum simply doesn't know what to say or how to say it. Because you are sensitive, she may think better say nothing, than say wrong. Of course you're grieving, you love your mum and possibly feel a bit jealous that your MIL (even though she is not your mum), you wish she was, or your mum could be like her. My mum is deceased, has been over 20 years, like you we were estranged, I wasn't wanted or loved. My first MIL was the same as yours, so I turned to her when my daughter was born. Maybe, as I said, your mum does love you, but simply doesn't want to say the wrong thing. Have you tried writing to your mum expressing your desire to make friends. I know how hard it is, I've been there with my mum. It could be also your mum could be battling her own demons, feeling guilty for not being able to understand you. Trying to explain depression to someone to someone who doesn't understand is like teaching a foreign language. There is material you can download which explains depression, perhaps if you could download and give it to mum to read in her own time. If you can 'log on' to Beyond Blue, they have a section which explains depression, caring for depressed people etc.

[PeppiPatty]

Dear @pip

How are you tonight? I read your message with interest but no......I've been in Psychotherapy for many years and back again with my Psychotherapist to deal with this and ......no mail will heal any rift. She has even had papers published in her field on why she treats me like she does. 

What I'm interested in though is how you dealt with the estrangement ?

How are you today? The last time I saw my Mum she told me that she will never help me out with purchasing a home but she brought my brother his second home. Then when I was spluttering a little to ask questions, she had the excuse to tell my brothers that I'm jealous of them.

This is not the case at all. 

My husband and my Psychotherapist are telling me that if I do nothing,,,,,,, life will work it out and my middle brother will work out that my problems with my Mum are not about money at all. But it hurts that I feel I've been twisted into this what is happening. 

I know that she has used my emotional self for my brothers to laugh at me behind my back, my son told me that this is what was happening. 

I will read the beyong Blue sheets.

What do you think of that writer and Psychotherapist writes in that Depression is about not being able to grieve....??

[Sehnsucht]

I refer to depression as limbo.

Depression is where even choosing to choose to choose to choose a word is... silence. Shutting down. Overwhelmed with choice and contradictions and lies or truths or reality or what is reality? Am I allowed to think? No. Yes. No. Shut up. Speak! Just shut up...

And so on.

And it's limbo in a visual sense because you're bending over backwards in order to just have the bar lowered further.

[Sehnsucht]

As for the greive tripe? No.

What professional tells anyone they must or how to grieve anyway? Support people through greif or trauma, stop squashing us so we fit in some archaic hole.

[Sehnsucht]

Thinking more, there is so much I feel I have yet to grieve. Family that died when I was acute. My schooling. The years I lost. Relationships with my family. It all washes over me from time to time, as I suppose these things do. But I was acutely depressed then psychotic before these things. And despite these things, I am neither depressed nor psychotic now.

Thinking more about your mum and your grief, you can only try, but have in place how you'll proceed on either situation: if it goes well or bad.

I can relate to MIL over mum scenario. Hope you're ok x

[pip]

PeppiPatty. Your mum and mine could've been sisters. My mum frequently accused me of harboring jealous feelings towards my abusive older brother (whom she favored). When my father passed 40 odd years ago, my 'true' mother came out. To explain, yes, she resented me, I prevented her from being able to work by the mere fact I was born. As soon as she decided I was 'old enough' about 9 or 10, off she went to work leaving me at the mercy of my brother. He started abusing me from the time I was 8, yes, she knew, turned a blind eye. Dad died (as I said, out went me - fast). I was devastated, I'd lost dad, now mum. To add insult to injury I started hearing about what a 'wonderful' aunt she was. My grief was doubled, I had lost two parents. My dad never knew about my brother. Depression hit - hard. I tried for years to 'win' back the affection I had never had, blamed myself for not being good enough. Fast forward to now. I have made friends, I value me because I don't have to pretend to be what I'm not. Mum died 20 years ago, it hurt, because her final insult was to cut me out of her will. She favored my brother, so much he benefitted. Now I realize how much I've benefitted in a way that I never expected. I simply changed my way of thinking, by accepting that mum's problem wasn't my fault. I did have some psychotherapy, but mainly through learning to love and accept 'me', I now have heaps of friends. I don't expect anything I can't give. Grieving is a personal experience and many emotions can be caused including depression. There are many emotions attached to grief, anger, hurt, betrayal, denial. Accept your anger and all other emotions. Allow yourself to grieve, allow the anger. Once you allow these emotions, you will start to heal. Through grief we also become stronger and understand ourselves. I have many friends who suffer various forms of mental illness. Depression is a form of mental illness, but depression, like mental illness can be controlled either therapy or AD's ,or both. I have also learnt to forgive my mother. In order to grow, I had to forgive. I haven't forgotten, possibly never will, but it doesn't rule my life. I am in charge of me and the past is now 'locked away'. I can't change the past, but I can control my future. Grieving is not necessarily depression, as grieving is usually a temporary condition, where depression can be life long.

[Former-Member]

Hi Peppi, I can relate to an unloving mother, its hard to grieve someone who's still alive, but also, if your mum's anything like mine - you don't know her well or overlap lives. How do we grieve someone we don't know? Don't connect with, as an adult. But then there's our inner child, that part that loves our parents regardless of what they were like, and longs to have the connected relationship we need, to survive. I'm always hoping my mar will come good but she's not mellowed with her terminal cancer ordeal. Worse, confronting, cruel, vindictive, manipulative & even vulgar. I won't grievecthat. But her existence has always been a part of my life & she clearly haa never been well mentally. ..

I've heard depression referred to as frozen anger. Anger is part of grief, so it makes sense. We find it hard to let go. Also, in forgiveness can keep us chained too, and not let go.

[chookmojo]

 @PeppiPatty

I have only ever had VERY mild depression, much more of an anxiety gal myself. When I did have it I found the incredibly classic words "It's like being at the bottom of deep dark well, with no way to get out" spontaneously coming out of my mouth, which was when I thought, "Whoops, that's depression! Get thee to a medic!"

When I was doing Chinese Medicine many moons agaio we were taught that depression was was a deep form of of continued frustration of unexpressed anger, or frustrated action. It is considered a disorder of the Liver - particularly stagnation of the liver.

That always made a lot of sense to me, and in the couple of instances where my life has been brushed by depression it genuinely was as a result of feeling hopeless and unable to change a situation, at my anger being unheard.

[Appleblossom]

I agree with the all that has been said about anger frozen or unexpressed

or maybe the p@roblem was not of the inner journey .. maybe it was the outer journey .. that others were determined not to listen.

I suspect that may be some of the case with your mother .. hmmm .. really she is publishing in the field ... there is no smiley ... for stern Apple disapproval ...

take care ...

I also agree with @pip's comment ... in that I was the oldest child and I have settled that a lot of my relation had little to do with me but was about the crime of being born .. it is so sad that it can take a lot of our energies.

Dont play into her manipulations .. you dont need her to buy you a home .. you are secure in your situation ... I HOPE ... Dear @PeppiPatty maintain your dignity in the amazing life you have lead ...and the choices you have made to be loving ...